Question

Obviously, we all believe that Jesus must be "Lord" for us to be saved--to have salvation.  How does that fit in, because we hear so often about Carnal Christians, what is a Carnal Christian?  If Jesus is Lord, then how can we be living a fleshly life?

Answer

You ask these big issues, these big questions.  Let's start with one point--OK?  Let me ask you a question, "Is Jesus Lord?"  [yes].  We don't need to debate that--right?  People say all the time, "Well, you know, I made Jesus Lord."  I just go, "Wait a minute, you didn't make Him anything, you didn't create Christ--He's Lord--period."  Let me ask you a second question, "Can you obey Him?" [yes].  "Can you disobey Him?" [yes].  "Does that change whether He is in charge?" [no]. 

So the Lordship of Christ is a clear cut thing in Scripture--very clear.  I believe that there is no way to divest Christ of His Lordship.  Now, I know that there is a big debate about whether "curios" (Greek) means "deity" and "deity" alone or whether it implies authority.  I don't think there is any question that it implies authority. 

I was having lunch with a professor one day, and he said, "Well, I believe that all that "curios" (that's the Greek word for Lord) means is "deity."  I said, "OK, I don't agree with that because Thomas wouldn't have said, 'My Lord, and my God,' that's redundant if they both mean deity, 'Lord' must have meant something to enhance the thought of God--deity."  I said, "Let's assume, however, that "Lord" only means "deity."  Then I said, "What does that mean?"  "Are you telling me that doesn't mean that He is in charge?"  "Are you telling me that He is God, but He is just not in charge?"  So, you don't gain a thing by that. 

The Bible is clear that Jesus is Lord and if "Lord" means "God" then "God" means that He is in charge!  So I believe that when you come to Jesus Christ--He is in charge of your life.  Where this "Carnal Christian" thing came in; I think where it became popularized was through a little book that Campus Crusade put out a number of years ago (we used to call it the "Bluebird Book"), it had three little circles. 

In circle number one you had an unbeliever.  It was a little circle and there was a throne in the middle and self was on the throne, and chaos in the life--that's an unbeliever. 

Then you had another circle, which was called the Carnal Christian.  You had a throne and self was on the throne, and the Lord was in the circle, but He was over in the corner--that was the Carnal Christian.  In other words, he believed, but he was still in charge of his own life.

The third circle was the spiritual Christian--the little throne had the Lord on it and self was in the corner, and everything in the life was orderly.  What that conveyed was, that when you become a Christian you can go into any of those two circles.  Right?  You can be a self-controlled Christian or a Lord-controlled Christian.  That is what I react against.  I don't believe that there is any such thing as a Christian with self on the throne.  I think that there are only Christians with the Lord on the throne--some are obedient and some are disobedient. 

What is a Carnal Christian?  Well, if you mean a fleshly one--that's a disobedient believer, but that has nothing to do with whether the Lord is one the throne or not.  He is the ruler of your life.  He is the master of your life, it is only a question of whether you are obeying Him. 

Now, let me tell you one other thing, I believe that when a person comes to faith in Jesus Christ, they don't have the option to accept Him just as Savior and keep self on the throne.  See, that's the argument with the Carnal Christian idea--is that you can be saved and not necessarily have a changed life because you are still running your life.  In other words, it is as if salvation is only forensic, in other words, it is just God writing your name on the list and saying, "Well, he's saved,"--nothing changes.

You can be disobedient.  Just keep it simple: when you are saved it is a total transformation.  Christ is on the throne of your life and you are either obedient or disobedient.  If you are disobedient--you are not holy.  If you are obedient--you are.